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VV9 compatibility
Submitted by Richard Luft on Sat, 03/24/2007 - 17:56.
I notice that whenever I open the VV9 app, my sound system mutes, and I have to manually de-mute it so as to use the speech dictation system.
I have VV9 installed on a Win XP Pro opsys.
Does anyone know if VV9 is incompatible with this opsys? Once un-muted, the dictation system seems to work fine.
Richard
Our ViaVoice knowledge is
Our ViaVoice knowledge is somewhat limited so we apologize in advance if we don't get the answer quite right. It's our understanding that ViaVoice 10.5 was released to enable full Windows XP and Office 2003 compliance. If your only problem is turning on the microphone then it may not be cost effective to upgrade to Ver. 10.5 and you might also want to keep in mind that ViaVoice has been discontinued for quite some time. The product is still manufactured and sold but development was 86ed several years ago and will not be supported by Windows Vista. At some point in the future you may have to consider NaturallySpeaking 9 or Vista which both, in our testing, were nearly twice as accurate.
KnowBrainer Support Staff - Lunis Orcutt
Dictated with DNS 9, KnowBrainer and UniVoice
Thanks for informative
Thanks for informative responses. My original attraction to VV was the very inexpensive medical dictionary (as compared to DNS).
Undoubedly , if VV is incompatible with Vista, then I'll ultimately have to switch----but for now, I'm avoiding Vista like the plague.
Actually, I'm not sure if VV is also slowing down MSAccess 2003, so it sounds wise to upgrade to 10.5 for the abovementioned compliance.
Thanx again
Richard
Richard Luft wrote: .... if
.... if VV is incompatible with Vista, then I'll ultimately have to switch----but for now, I'm avoiding Vista like the plague.
At this stage it has not been finally confirmed that VV will not work in Vista. Nobody appears to have tried it yet. It is merely presumptions which have been made, although Rob Chambers of Microsoft Speech stated that he believed VV would work in Vista. Until somebody tries it, we will not know.
However, notwithstanding the Vista is now standard in all new computers bought off the shelf, the general impression that I get from what I am reading is that most users are going to wait ½ -2 years before going in the Vista direction.
Actually, I'm not sure if VV is also slowing down MSAccess 2003, so it sounds wise to upgrade to 10.5 for the abovementioned compliance.
It sounds as though you're using Office 2003. Are you using Word 2003 as well? If so is VV 9 working in it?
10.5 is specifically designed to work in Office 2003.
Quentin
"It sounds as though you're
"It sounds as though you're using Office 2003. Are you using Word 2003 as well? If so is VV 9 working in it?
10.5 is specifically designed to work in Office 2003."
Yes, office2003 is what I'm using. Word 2003 works quite well, but not as well as speakpad (guess this could be what you're all speaking of). I see lots of ads on e-bay for VV10, but nobody seems to specify VV10.5.
Needless to say, I also don't know whether I need an 'advanced' edition (if such a thing exists) in order to be able to add a specialty vocabulary (as was needed with VV9).
Richard
Richard Luft wrote: Yes,
Yes, office2003 is what I'm using. Word 2003 works quite well, but not as well as speakpad (guess this could be what you're all speaking of).
I am surprised that VV 9 worked in Word 2003.
I see lots of ads on e-bay for VV10, but nobody seems to specify VV10.5.
Needless to say, I also don't know whether I need an 'advanced' edition (if such a thing exists) in order to be able to add a specialty vocabulary (as was needed with VV9).
Richard
As far as I can see from the Nuance site, there is only the Standard and Pro USB editions.
The Standard Edition only appears to go up to Office 2002.
On the VV 10.5 Pro USB, for some odd reason, the box and CD labels were not changed from 10 to 10.5.
There are two things to watch:-
1. On the box, it is clearly shown as being compatible with Word 2003
2. On the CD, the copyright is shown up to 2004.
These are the two indications to show that it is 10.5. There are many spurious Vendors selling the previous 10.0 version very cheaply - probably old stock. The only way of being certain is to buy it off Nuance on the Net. If it is the UK Nuance, then it will come with two options of either UK or US vocabularies built in and you can choose which one you want to install. I believe it is the same with US site.
Quentin
Got replies from vendors
Got replies from vendors that the boxes only state that VV10 edition is "compatible w WinXP. I presume that this is less than what you so specifically indicated?
Richard Luft wrote: Got
Got replies from vendors that the boxes only state that VV10 edition is "compatible w WinXP. I presume that this is less than what you so specifically indicated?
Correct. Don't touch them - they're only Ver. 10, not 10.5.
Quentin
We think it's time to let
We think it's time to let ViaVoice die a peaceful death. ViaVoice technology was effectively abandoned several years ago and the latest versions of NaturallySpeaking typically produce as much as 40% less errors. If you're serious about speech recognition, NaturallySpeaking is now you're only answer. If you are using this software professionally, don't skimp on your tools. You've never seen a stethoscope with the letter K. (as in Kmart) on it. At this point, ViaVoice would have to be considered Kmart quality. If you feel that you simply cannot justify the purchase of NaturallySpeaking Medical 9, you can always go with NaturallySpeaking consumer grade Preferred 9 and add a third party vocabulary.
KnowBrainer Support Staff - Lunis Orcutt
Dictated with DNS 9, KnowBrainer and UniVoice
This may be sound advise,
This may be sound advise, but not at the moment. I currently have my VV well trained to my speech, and at present, don't have the incentive to 'train' new software. My VV recognition is around 99%.
Richard
Richard Luft wrote: My VV
My VV recognition is around 99%.
You won't get much better than this with DNS
If it ain't broke don't fix it.
Quentin
KnowBrainer, do you never
KnowBrainer, do you never give up. Why can't you let go. If a person is happy with VV, stop trying to convert him. I'm quite sure that he is fully aware of DNS, particularly if he reads this site, and presumably will be sick of seeing your constant attacks on VV.
Leave it alone and concentrate on your own site, as well as people who ask for help or information on this site regarding DNS.
Quentin
crivon1 wrote: Richard
.... if VV is incompatible with Vista, then I'll ultimately have to switch----but for now, I'm avoiding Vista like the plague.
At this stage it has not been finally confirmed that VV will not work in Vista. Nobody appears to have tried it yet. It is merely presumptions which have been made, although Rob Chambers of Microsoft Speech stated that he believed VV would work in Vista. Until somebody tries it, we will not know.
Quentin,
I regret that I have to disappoint ViaVoice users regarding Vista compatibility.
If you have and use IBM ViaVoice 10.0/10.5, do not upgrade to Windows Vista with that SR product installed (i.e., from Windows XP). If you have version 9, it will not install on all. In addition, do not install IBM ViaVoice 10.0/10.5 on Windows Vista. It is absolutely incompatible. The install will not complete. It will look like it's installing fine, but it will hang when it comes to installing the navigation macros and the installation will fail at that point. On Windows Vista Ultimate even Vista's attempt to fix the compatibility issues will fail. The result is that you will have approximately 93% of IBM ViaVoice installed on Windows Vista incompletely. It will not load (i.e., missing registry entries and incomplete install prompts with an error that Vista cannot launch ViaVoice for these reasons) and you cannot uninstall it using the normal uninstall procedures. In addition, you will end up with approximately 431 registry entries left over from the incomplete install that you will have to remove manually one by one because of the Windows Vista registry protection. Therefore, if you have installed and are using IBM ViaVoice, do not upgrade to Windows Vista if you intend to continue using it. You will regret the day that you did if you do. How do I know this? I've already thoroughly tested it on 2 machines with Windows Vista Ultimate and Windows Vista Business. The results are identical for both test machines and both test scenarios.
I've installed on a clean Windows Vista and install with only Microsoft Office 2003 and no other apps. I've attempted to upgrade to Windows XP with ViaVoice 10.5 installed with similar results, even though it can be uninstalled under this condition. Basically, ViaVoice will not launch. ViaVoice 9 simply will not install. The install fails as soon as ViaVoice attempts a reboot to complete the install of the rest of the ViaVoice 9 files.
I've tested as thoroughly in the hopes that there was possibly some way of making it work under Windows Vista. Unfortunately, no such luck. I tried as best I could to be unbiased and objective, and I spent about 5 hours trying to make it work. So, I'm not just approaching this from the standpoint of making an unsubstantiated claim. It's simply did not work in all of my test scenarios. However, if anybody finds a way to make it work, which I doubt that you will, a post to this thread would be very useful for those who use ViaVoice.
Sorry all. I tried my damnedest and I was as thorough as possible.
Chuck Runquist
Former DNS SDK & Senior Technical Solutions PM for DNS
'Your living is determined not so much by what life brings to you as by the attitude you bring to life; not so much by what happens to you as by the way your mind looks at what happens.' --Kahlil Gibran
It seems to me that every
It seems to me that every time a major Windows upgrade comes along, everything you had before is no longer usable. Is it just me in my senility or is this real?
For a lot of people that might want to upgrade to Vista, the path is very expensive. For me, it would require a whole new computer and printer. With that pricing, it's just not something I want to do anymore. I just don't understand why they do this! It doesn't seem they give a lot of thought to backward compatibility when they begin their new designs/upgrades.
Reminds me of "If it's not broke, don't fix it!".
so, you don't think that
so, you don't think that this is a purposeful routine by MS?
I think that all of these software vendors feed upon each other, and MS.
I'm also sure that Symantec pays hackers to design malware just so they can keep selling their annual updates!
Richard Luft wrote: so, you
so, you don't think that this is a purposeful routine by MS?
I think that all of these software vendors feed upon each other, and MS.
I'm also sure that Symantec pays hackers to design malware just so they can keep selling their annual updates!
It's not something that would ever be proven I'm sure. I've heard similar ideas about other large Anti-Virus program authors as well.
I ran into a situation yesterday where an entire system was run on Windows 2000! It's been a while since I've seen or worked with Win2k, but it was interesting nonetheless. When I asked why they did it, I was told it was more cost effective as it did all the office and the inter-tied network required!
So that tells me that not everyone is on the bleeding razor edge of technology, nor can some people afford to be! Now to get a few of the large vendors to realize that!
Chuck Runquist wrote: I
I regret that I have to disappoint ViaVoice users regarding Vista compatibility.
If you have and use IBM ViaVoice 10.0/10.5, do not upgrade to Windows Vista with that SR product installed (i.e., from Windows XP). If you have version 9, it will not install on all. In addition, do not install IBM ViaVoice 10.0/10.5 on Windows Vista. It is absolutely incompatible. The install will not complete. It will look like it's installing fine, but it will hang when it comes to installing the navigation macros and the installation will fail at that point.
That also happens on occasions in XP. The work around is to complete the installation without the macros. These can then be imported after VV has set up. I have done this. It has adds few more minutes to the installation. However I have got round this by having backed up all my macros (having deleted the unwanted ones such as Lotus, WordPro etc. ) and on re-installation, I simply import my backup.
On Windows Vista Ultimate even Vista's attempt to fix the compatibility issues will fail. The result is that you will have approximately 93% of IBM ViaVoice installed on Windows Vista incompletely. It will not load (i.e., missing registry entries and incomplete install prompts with an error that Vista cannot launch ViaVoice for these reasons) and you cannot uninstall it using the normal uninstall procedures.
See my reply above. On the basis of what you are stating, using my work around, it may be possible to install in Vista.
In addition, you will end up with approximately 431 registry entries left over from the incomplete install that you will have to remove manually one by one because of the Windows Vista registry protection.
Can this not be done with a registry cleaner such as Ccleaner or RegScrub ?
I've already thoroughly tested it on 2 machines with Windows Vista Ultimate and Windows Vista Business. The results are identical for both test machines and both test scenarios.
Why not try what I suggest above . The macros can be imported from the macros folder in the installation disc.
I am not surprised you failed on VV 9. It is relatively old.
As regards the failure to register the uninstallation files, this should not be of major concern, since there are many ways uninstalling without having to use Control Panel \Add Remove Programs
I've attempted to upgrade to Windows XP .....
A Freudian slip perhaps
I am glad to see somebody is trying, particularly an expert such as Chuck.
Eventually I will find someone with Vista who will let me experiment. I reckon it is is going to be quite some time before I will upgrade - although I would dearly love to get a Core 2 Duo laptop, but I have no excuse at the moment. Even if my hard disk expires, it is very easy to replace relatively cheaply. However maybe for my next, or the next after, birthday a generous benefactor might oblige
Quentin
Quentin, When I get a chance
Quentin,
When I get a chance I'll give your suggestions and try. However, I don't see, and never have seen where you can prevent the install (i.e. clean install) from exempting the navigation macro installation.
As regards the removing of the registry entries, I use registry crawler, which allows multiple selections and finds all of the entries relative to a particular application installation. However, what I was referring to was the fact that Windows Vista has a very protective permissions set up that doesn't allow selecting multiple entries and deleting them and one shot. Note that registry crawler is better than any of the other ones that you've suggested and has many more features.
You still have to change the permissions for each one of those 431 entries before you can delete them. I have yet to find a registry cleaner that will allow multiple selections and changing the permissions on all of them at the same time. If you have one or you know of one, let me know because this is going to be a big pain in the butt with Vista.
I'll let you know how I make out with your suggestions.
Chuck Runquist
Former DNS SDK & Senior Technical Solutions PM for DNS
As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. - Josh Billings (1818-1885)
Chuck Runquist wrote: I
I don't see, and never have seen where you can prevent the install (i.e. clean install) from exempting the navigation macro installation.
It happens continually on a re-installation and clean install in XP. You cannot choose to install without the macros. However what happens is that the macros are the last actions to be completed in install. If the macros are not going to install, it comes up with an error 90 and you simply click OK for each macro it tries to install. It then finishes. I then follow the procedure I suggested by manually importing the macros. This problem never happens with 2000.
Note that registry crawler is better than any of the other ones that you've suggested and has many more features.
I have'nt tried that one.
You still have to change the permissions for each one of those 431 entries before you can delete them. I have yet to find a registry cleaner that will allow multiple selections and changing the permissions on all of them at the same time. If you have one or you know of one, let me know because this is going to be a big pain in the butt with Vista.
That's a bummer
They'll have to change that, so that one can avoid the pain. Someone will come up with a Registry cleaner that will work in Vista. Enough to keep one with XP!
Quentin
crivon1 wrote: It happens
It happens continually on a re-installation and clean install in XP. You cannot choose to install without the macros. However what happens is that the macros are the last actions to be completed in install. If the macros are not going to install, it comes up with an error 90 and you simply click OK for each macro it tries to install. It then finishes. I then follow the procedure I suggested by manually importing the macros. This problem never happens with 2000.
Quentin,
Based on your post above, this may preclude being able to install ViaVoice on Vista. The reason is that when you get to the navigation macro install, you don't get the error 90, the install aborts at that point and won't continue. Therefore, you're left with an incomplete install. In short, it never tries to install the macros. It's simply quits with an error at that point, then aborts with the compatibility issue message.
The problem here is that the installation never completes and never finishes registering the product completely.
Is this the end of the road, or do you have another suggestion that might work. If not, I think you're dead in the water at this point.
Chuck Runquist
Former DNS SDK & Senior Technical Solutions PM for DNS
As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. - Josh Billings (1818-1885)
Chuck Runquist wrote: The
The problem here is that the installation never completes and never finishes registering the product completely.
As far as I know, the registration is dealt with prior to the installation of macros. Having gone that far, will ViaVoice start? It should have installed everything necessary up to the macros. Ideally one should have voice files from an XP, 2000 or Win 98 installation to be imported. Does IBM ViaVoice Options in Control Panel work? That is where one would choose the particular user files.
If I were installing in Vista this way, I would use Task Manager to end the installation. (I did this successfully in XP on one occasion, and VV worked .)
Is this the end of the road, or do you have another suggestion that might work. If not, I think you're dead in the water at this point.
I have always adopted the motto "never say never" and I have usually found a way through and apparent cul-de-sac.
I will give you a final verdict when I find my guinea pig.
My son in London has just built a new computer, and I think he got Vista, and if so, maybe he will let me try it out next week when I am there.
Quentin
Cool! Sail away and let him
Cool! Sail away and let him clean up the mess
Or does he back up as diligently as you do?
We will, of course, expect a complete report on your stunning success
Bruce
crivon1 wrote: Chuck
The problem here is that the installation never completes and never finishes registering the product completely.
As far as I know, the registration is dealt with prior to the installation of macros. Having gone that far, will ViaVoice start? It should have installed everything necessary up to the macros. Ideally one should have voice files from an XP, 2000 or Win 98 installation to be imported. Does IBM ViaVoice Options in Control Panel work? That is where one would choose the particular user files.
If I were installing in Vista this way, I would use Task Manager to end the installation. (I did this successfully in XP on one occasion, and VV worked .)
Is this the end of the road, or do you have another suggestion that might work. If not, I think you're dead in the water at this point.
I have always adopted the motto "never say never" and I have usually found a way through and apparent cul-de-sac.
I will give you a final verdict when I find my guinea pig.
My son in London has just built a new computer, and I think he got Vista, and if so, maybe he will let me try it out next week when I am there.
Quentin
Both DNS and ViaVoice engines are OS independent. That is, they should work as long as you can get them installed. I got DNS 9.1 to work in Windows Vista by changing parameters and permissions, but it wasn't easy. However, it's getting the engines to run without getting a whole bunch of compatibility errors. If you get your guinea pig, have them try upgrading to Vista with ViaVoice already installed. That's the way I got DNS 9.1 to work because it wouldn't install.
When I get the chance, I'll go back and bang on it again and see if I can find the cracks that I can slide through.
Chuck Runquist
Former DNS SDK & Senior Technical Solutions PM for DNS
As scarce as truth is, the supply has always been in excess of the demand. - Josh Billings (1818-1885)
Richard, Since KnowBrainer
Richard,
Since KnowBrainer claims he knows very little about ViaVoice I do not understand why he bothers to post other than to promote the DNS sales
As I have previously reported, XP does funny things, particularly with ViaVoice. Yours is a new symptom I have not come across.
Since VV 9 works for you in XP, apart from the audio control problem, then it is not incompatible.
I can only suggest that you put up with the existing problem, or, as KnowBrainer suggested, pick up a copy of VV 10.5. This would appear to be obtainable quite cheaply on the net, since you will only need the disc. You should be able to import your voice files and macros.
The precautions before doing this, such as backing up, etc., are set out in previous postings I put on this site, and you will find them if you search my name.
I can recommend 10.5, as it is working very well for me in XP, and I'm sure you want to keep your SR system.
Quentin